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    iadtatami 682 2012-02-08 18:09:46.0 login to vote score 2
    I like the 4th edition rules better - pneumas get 3 feats a day starting at level 0.
    fatsean 3838 2012-02-08 18:16:44.0 login to vote score 3
    Hippy dippy crystal gripping bullshit.
    eddyatwork 998 2012-02-08 18:20:52.0 login to vote score 3
    Is this really badly written Captain Planet fanfic?
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-08 18:21:38.0 login to vote score 0
    fatsean: Hippy dippy crystal gripping bullshit.

    It's just a series of ideas. It's not about believing it, it's about being able to think about it intelligently which is a useful exercise in itself.

    Of course, the Archon fellow travellers on this site want to shit all over everything they don't actively believe, like reductionist materialism. But let them try to fag up everything with their bullshit. They voted this link up regardless, and even the misleading headline will inspire some to click on it. And maybe, just maybe, someone will even think about it. So the actions of the fools work against themselves, even as they attempt to sabotage the ideas of their betters.
    iadtatami 682 2012-02-08 18:30:36.0 login to vote score 2
    Kabbalah

    Kabbalah

    Kabbalah is really neat!
    It is made of Hebrew feats!
    We believe in Kabbalah!
    tabernash 1083 2012-02-08 18:32:38.0 login to vote score 5
    Archontic figure?




    It's a FUCKING cloud.


    I should know. God knows that I yell at them often enough.
    gradivus 3607 2012-02-08 18:48:22.0 login to vote score 3
    This is just more of that Czar/cubeworlds bullshit.
    funklordtoejam 1042 2012-02-08 19:02:05.0 login to vote score 1
    I am 26 and what is this
    burntman 1528 2012-02-08 19:53:03.0 login to vote score 4
    funklordtoejam: I am 26 and what is this

    Badly misconstrued bullshit based on a half-arsed attempt at resurrecting old religious drivel. i.e. it's Wicca for people who are to embarrassed to dance naked.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-08 20:10:39.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: Badly misconstrued bullshit based on a half-arsed attempt at resurrecting old religious drivel. i.e. it's Wicca for people who are to embarrassed to dance naked.

    This coming from the guy who was eventually forced to admit that the otherkin phenomenon could be a valid cultural interpretation of shamanic experiences.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-08 20:10:56.0 login to vote score 0
    Doesn't anybody ever learn anything from their mistakes? Ever??
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-08 20:13:44.0 login to vote score 0
    mistakes
    dividebyxero 9383 2012-02-08 20:24:55.0 login to vote score 6
    czarangelus: Doesn't anybody ever learn anything from their mistakes? Ever??


    Of course we do. Which is why we stopped taking you seriously ages ago.

    burntman 1528 2012-02-08 20:26:07.0 login to vote score 3
    czarangelus: This coming from the guy who was eventually forced to admit that the otherkin phenomenon could be a valid cultural interpretation of shamanic experiences.

    no, that was not what I fucking admitted at all. Go back and look at that thread. Otherkin are not a valid cultural interpretation of shamanic experiences. Otherkin are dumb fuck teenagers who are trying too hard to establish fantastical personas for themselves.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-08 20:37:46.0 login to vote score 4
    czarangelus: Doesn't anybody ever learn anything from their mistakes? Ever??

    Here you stupid fuck:

    What I said was that you had a point that Phillip K. Dicks drug addled musings sound a lot like the theories of modern physicists.

    burntman: Philip K. Dick said some incredibly stupid things. Being wired out of his skull, didn't do much for his grip on reality.

    czarangelus: IN a world where reputable scientists can ask, is the universe a four dimensional crystal growing in a five dimensional superfluid, I think you're being radically unfair.

    burntman: touche. You do have a point.

    That was the fucking conversation. That is a lot fucking different from "forced to admit that the otherkin phenomenon could be a valid cultural interpretation of shamanic experiences."

    So if you are going to spew your purile bullshit, at least make sure that you get your references fucking right.

    Heres the complete thread since you now seem to think that making shit up is a perfectly valid stance.

    czarangelus 646 2012-02-08 21:01:31.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: Here you stupid fuck
    Heres the complete thread since you now seem to think that making shit up is a perfectly valid stance.


    if I'd known it was that important to you to shit on other people, I would have done a half hour of research before quoting from imperfect memory.

    You're right too. Anybody who doesn't agree with your brand of reductionism is a waste of oxygen. Good thing we have you around to validate all our experiences
    burntman 1528 2012-02-08 21:20:17.0 login to vote score 5
    czarangelus: if I'd known it was that important to you to shit on other people, I would have done a half hour of research before quoting from imperfect memory.

    You're right too. Anybody who doesn't agree with your brand of reductionism is a waste of oxygen. Good thing we have you around to validate all our experiences


    You accuse me of supporting your half arsed musings and now are all taken aback when I point out that I didn't?

    Well here's a news flash, your ideas are that stupid that I do find the very idea that I've somehow acknowledge them as anything more than the purile shit they are as very offensive.

    And no, it's not my "brand of reductionism", rather it's that you submit ideas that properly belong to a precocious teenager as if they were some kind of fantastic revelation. I hate to break it to you, but Chopra, Crowley, Hubbard or whichever charlatan of the month you're espousing is not going to impress anyone. We have fucking google, nothing of that sort is arcane or obscure anymore. The gospel of thomas has a wikipage.

    Jesus, popstars are talking about the Kabalah, and you're still acting like there's some sort of hidden mystery or revelation to be found in all this shit.

    You're just a fundie looking for a dogma. And that's ok, but if you tell most people about it. Well they're going to call it stupid. Because it is.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-08 21:49:04.0 login to vote score 0
    ah yes. As I recall, Chopra, Crowley, and Hubbard were really big on the otherkin. I think I remember that portion of the Call of the 7th Aethyr.

    The fantastic revelation doesn't come from espousing the ideas of others. The fantastic revelation comes from within. I don't really have a life that's full of many miracles, apart from the everyday ones. On the other hand, I'm not so desperately void of it that I have to crap all over it when somebody else interprets it differently.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-08 22:24:49.0 login to vote score 4
    czarangelus: On the other hand, I'm not so desperately void of it that I have to crap all over it when somebody else interprets it differently.

    You just don't seem to get it do you? Pluralism does not suddenly mean every idea has to be accepted as valid. Stupid ideas remain stupid ideas. And people can recognise them as such.

    Now what you are calling for is for the suspension of our critical faculties when you present your ideas. There's a term for that. It's called faith. And if your going to do that, well shit, you might as well stick to bible. Even if no more rational, it at least has the benefit of familiarity to most people. Alternatively if you really have to be controversial embrace Islam. But trying to create a religion from the detritus of human history is not only incredibly silly, its not even novel. Can it be done. Sure Gardner did it with wicca. Can you sell that shit to others on the internet? Well you've seen the general reaction when you present your ideas. Why do you think that is? We're all closed minded and you alone somehow have opened yourself to truths? An open mind, does not mean a mind free of critical thought.
    so vote republican 6688 2012-02-08 22:47:57.0 login to vote score 0
    I, for one, completely understand this Czar.

    I get it.
    cannonhawk 849 2012-02-08 23:03:18.0 login to vote score 8
    burntman: no, that was not what I fucking admitted at all. Go back and look at that thread. Otherkin are not a valid cultural interpretation of shamanic experiences. Otherkin are dumb fuck teenagers who are trying too hard to establish fantastical personas for themselves.

    You know czar is the joker to your Batman, dude.
    iadtatami 682 2012-02-08 23:13:34.0 login to vote score 3
    My indigo child can beat up your half-faerie werewolf.
    so vote republican 6688 2012-02-08 23:49:17.0 login to vote score 4
    cannonhawk: You know czar is the joker to your Batman, dude.

    Nah. Joker is the Czar to our Burntman.

    Some men just want to watch the world prance.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 00:33:28.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: You just don't seem to get it do you? Pluralism does not suddenly mean every idea has to be accepted as valid. Stupid ideas remain stupid ideas. And people can recognise them as such.

    Now what you are calling for is for the suspension of our critical faculties when you present your ideas. There's a term for that. It's called faith. And if your going to do that, well shit, you might as well stick to bible. Even if no more rational, it at least has the benefit of familiarity to most people. Alternatively if you really have to be controversial embrace Islam. But trying to create a religion from the detritus of human history is not only incredibly silly, its not even novel. Can it be done. Sure Gardner did it with wicca. Can you sell that shit to others on the internet? Well you've seen the general reaction when you present your ideas. Why do you think that is? We're all closed minded and you alone somehow have opened yourself to truths? An open mind, does not mean a mind free of critical thought.


    So you are, essentially, a religiofascist. Belief, or assumptions taken from direct experience, only have any value if you can convince other people that they're true. So tell me something.

    How many people have to believe that there's an invisible goddess with a thousand arms of compassion before it becomes magically true? A million? Ten million? How many people have to believe in a god with the head of a jackal, or a horndog and jealous lightning deity, or a man who died on a cross and then came back to life? Since all that matters is getting everyone to agree with you, what is the exact figure I should strive for before I'm allowed to take the experiences of myself and others seriously?

    so vote republican 6688 2012-02-09 00:43:06.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: So you are, essentially, a religiofascist. Belief, or assumptions taken from direct experience, only have any value if you can convince other people that they're true. So tell me something.

    How many people have to believe that there's an invisible goddess with a thousand arms of compassion before it becomes magically true? A million? Ten million? How many people have to believe in a god with the head of a jackal, or a horndog and jealous lightning deity, or a man who died on a cross and then came back to life? Since all that matters is getting everyone to agree with you, what is the exact figure I should strive for before I'm allowed to take the experiences of myself and others seriously?


    Around twenty thousand I think.
    dividebyxero 9383 2012-02-09 00:57:13.0 login to vote score 0
    so vote republican: Around twenty thousand I think.


    No, the union upped it to 35,000.
    code_7 6865 2012-02-09 01:21:27.0 login to vote score 2
    dividebyxero: No, the union upped it to 35,000.


    so vote republican: Around twenty thousand I think.

    Guys, guys you are both repeating propaganda put forth by the liberal media. The truth is they changed to to a direct percentage of population.

    And that percentage is 42.
    john rimbauer 3122 2012-02-09 01:24:41.0 login to vote score 3
    How on earth can anyone have a rational conversation about subjective events? If I claim that when I meditate, my trousers turn purple and my cat plays the trombone, then I deserve hearty skepticism. When I justify the fact that no one else can see this by explaining that I have the soul of a Mallee Scrub fowl then you can move on to outright derision. Any -ology that relies on completely subjective phenomena is, in my opinion, substituting faith for empirical evidence.

    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 05:19:31.0 login to vote score 4
    czarangelus: So you are, essentially, a religiofascist. Belief, or assumptions taken from direct experience, only have any value if you can convince other people that they're true. So tell me something.

    How many people have to believe that there's an invisible goddess with a thousand arms of compassion before it becomes magically true? A million? Ten million? How many people have to believe in a god with the head of a jackal, or a horndog and jealous lightning deity, or a man who died on a cross and then came back to life? Since all that matters is getting everyone to agree with you, what is the exact figure I should strive for before I'm allowed to take the experiences of myself and others seriously?


    No. And you're still not getting it. What I am saying is that deliberative ignoring your critical faculties as you are submitting people do, is stupid. You know how we scorn the young earth creationists? Or how we scorn the Scientology? Yeah, exactly like that. Just because you are spouting what you suppose to be wondrously arcane knowledge doesn't make it any more real nor does it make it relevant.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 06:40:41.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: No. And you're still not getting it. What I am saying is that deliberative ignoring your critical faculties as you are submitting people do, is stupid. You know how we scorn the young earth creationists? Or how we scorn the Scientology? Yeah, exactly like that. Just because you are spouting what you suppose to be wondrously arcane knowledge doesn't make it any more real nor does it make it relevant.

    I think the major difference is that the creationists et al. are parroting things they read in a book or that pastors taught them. They aren't based, at all, on a gnostic or numinous experience. That ought to be the fundamental distinction. "Did you see it." And you know, people ignore John Keel all day and night. I guess he was just a liar. So are the otherkin. Fuck it, the whole thing is made up and all phenomena are just a trick of the light.

    You can say that we're all just brains in a vat, but what have you gained?
    funklordtoejam 1042 2012-02-09 07:02:46.0 login to vote score 0
    Ponies?
    fatsean 3838 2012-02-09 07:07:46.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: I think the major difference is that the creationists et al. are parroting things they read in a book or that pastors taught them. They aren't based, at all, on a gnostic or numinous experience. That ought to be the fundamental distinction. "Did you see it." And you know, people ignore John Keel all day and night. I guess he was just a liar. So are the otherkin. Fuck it, the whole thing is made up and all phenomena are just a trick of the light.

    You can say that we're all just brains in a vat, but what have you gained?


    Now you're being dishonest. John Keel doesn't have to be a despicable liar. He could simply be delusional. Or has a tumor in his head. Or was dosed with LSD and has flashbacks at nice.

    As with most religious concepts, there's nothing there!
    dividebyxero 9383 2012-02-09 07:13:54.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: "Did you see it."


    Your eyes can deceive you, don't trust them.

    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 07:18:41.0 login to vote score 0
    fatsean: Now you're being dishonest. John Keel doesn't have to be a despicable liar. He could simply be delusional. Or has a tumor in his head. Or was dosed with LSD and has flashbacks at nice.As with most religious concepts, there's nothing there!

    or just.
    or just.
    or just.

    Anything but right!
    fatsean 3838 2012-02-09 07:55:03.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: or just.
    or just.
    or just.

    Anything but right!


    Anything but reality, right!
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 08:12:24.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: I think the major difference is that the creationists et al. are parroting things they read in a book or that pastors taught them. They aren't based, at all, on a gnostic or numinous experience.

    oh bullshit, how dare you now go and deride their experiences as not real. When they get "drunk on the spirit" or "feel the lords presence", you don't think they're also having intense emotional experiences?

    And as for parroting things out of books, what is it that you think your doing when you post quotes from the gospel of thomas or psuedo-kabbalahism, like in this article? Or when you refer to Sophia or Ein Soph. Do you really think that's any different from quoting any other biblical text? Really?
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 08:19:00.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: oh bullshit, how dare you now go and deride their experiences as not real. When they get "drunk on the spirit" or "feel the lords presence", you don't think they're also having intense emotional experiences? And as for parroting things out of books, what is it that you think your doing when you post quotes from the gospel of thomas or psuedo-kabbalahism, like in this article? Or when you refer to Sophia or Ein Soph. Do you really think that's any different from quoting any other biblical text? Really?

    Of course they're having a numinous experience. That doesn't mean they're interpreting it correctly, however. People who stick rigidly to a predefined framework find themselves trapped when confronted with what ought to be the equally valid experiences of a Sufi.

    In a way it's different; in a way it isn't. One thing I will say about the Nag Hammadi texts is that they're virtually useless unless you were raised on the Bible. In a lot of ways, they're an exegesis of and rebuttal to the Bible. I think it would be a mistake to believe that the creation account of On the Origin of the World or The Hypostasis of the Archons is true to the exclusion of facts about evolution. I think we're being provided with metaphors for a process that the human mind is not capable of apprehending. They're true, in that they're a way of communicating truth. They're false, in the way that the light in her eyes does not, in fact, dazzle like the stars.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 08:26:37.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: John Keel

    yeah sure, in that case why not give this guy some respect as well:



    or this guy:



    or how about tomato boy over here (he even does experiments):



    .


    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 08:33:15.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: yeah sure, in that case why not give this guy some respect as well: or this guy: or how about tomato boy over here (he even does experiments): .

    STOP THINKING WHAT I DON'T THINK
    eddyatwork 998 2012-02-09 08:35:50.0 login to vote score 0
    funklordtoejam: Ponies?

    Due to budget cuts, us libs can't afford unicorns anymore so we have to use ponies.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 08:45:04.0 login to vote score 0
    iadtatami: My indigo child can beat up your half-faerie werewolf.

    The question is what happens when reality comes a knocking and you eventually have to admit that your special child isn't so much "superhero special" as he is "doorknob special".

    Insights of an Indigo Mom: A Mother's Awakening by Jenny McCarthy

    She originally called herself an 'indigo mom' and claimed that her kid was "the next step on the evolutionary scale" or some such shit. Look how she handled it when she eventually had to admit that licking windows isn't really a superpower. Now she's on her anti-vaccine crusade and saying autism can be cured by chelation therapy. How many kids are going to get hurt by this shit still remains to be seen.

    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 08:46:56.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: STOP THINKING WHAT I DON'T THINK

    wait, how can you claim John Keel should be given due recognition but not John Edwards? Why not? Aren't you the one who was bringing up near death experiences a while ago? So why not John Edwards. He looks legit. He has his own tv show and everything.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 08:49:21.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: wait, how can you claim John Keel should be given due recognition but not John Edwards? Why not? Aren't you the one who was bringing up near death experiences a while ago? So why not John Edwards. He looks legit. He has his own tv show and everything.

    I think John Edwards started out with some admixture of truth and charlatanism, as is often the case with these things, and had to keep the gravy train rolling long after he mined the truth dry.

    As for Jenny McCarthy... the window lickers can be capable of extraordinary feats. It's just our society has no place for them.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 08:50:05.0 login to vote score 1
    czarangelus: Of course they're having a numinous experience. That doesn't mean they're interpreting it correctly, however.

    ah, yes. So now you get to be the arbiter of how to interpret things correctly.

    So anybody who doesn't agree with your brand of interpretation is a waste of oxygen. Good thing we have you around to validate how things should be interpreted


    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 08:54:55.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: ah, yes. So now you get to be the arbiter of how to interpret things correctly.So anybody who doesn't agree with your brand of interpretation is a waste of oxygen. Good thing we have you around to validate how things should be interpreted

    If you can only address the experiences of others by saying, "Satan/Iblis/Mara must be deceiving them!" I think perhaps you are not standing on firm ground.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 08:57:27.0 login to vote score 1
    czarangelus: If you can only address the experiences of others by saying, "Satan/Iblis/Mara must be deceiving them!" I think perhaps you are not standing on firm ground.

    Well if you extend your experiences to be universal truths with out any other rational than because "you feel it is", then you yourself are not on very firm ground either.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 08:58:50.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: Well if you extend your experiences to be universal truths with out any other rational than because "you feel it is", then you yourself are not on very firm ground either.

    None of this addresses Philip K Dick rushing his infant son to the hospital on the advice of a pink beam from Sirius and thus saving his life.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 09:07:29.0 login to vote score 1
    czarangelus: None of this addresses Philip K Dick rushing his infant son to the hospital on the advice of a pink beam from Sirius and thus saving his life.

    That has to be one of the most stupid posts you have ever posted.
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 09:08:13.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: That has to be one of the most stupid posts you have ever posted.

    Like it or not, that's the exact story as he reports it.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 09:11:36.0 login to vote score 0
    czarangelus: Like it or not, that's the exact story as he reports it.

    And John Edwards claims to speak to the recently diseased, and Uri Geller claims to be able to perform feats of telekinesis and L. Ron Hubbard, well he claimed a lot of shit.

    See where I'm going with this?
    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 09:14:49.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: And John Edwards claims to speak to the recently diseased, and Uri Geller claims to be able to perform feats of telekinesis and L. Ron Hubbard, well he claimed a lot of shit.See where I'm going with this?

    Philip K Dick took his son to a hospital based on advice from a pink beam from space. Do you think he's lying about that? That's stupider than anything. He wrote an eight thousand page, totally unpublishable diary, devoting years of his life to trying to understand what had happened to him and why. That isn't the behavior of a liar in search of commercialization.
    burntman 1528 2012-02-09 09:20:48.0 login to vote score 2
    czarangelus: Philip K Dick took his son to a hospital based on advice from a pink beam from space. Do you think he's lying about that? That's stupider than anything. He wrote an eight thousand page, totally unpublishable diary, devoting years of his life to trying to understand what had happened to him and why. That isn't the behavior of a liar in search of commercialization.

    yes, because writing long screeds detailing your personal thoughts and experiences makes them valid no matter how insane they are.


    antinasty 5945 2012-02-09 09:21:24.0 login to vote score 0

    czarangelus 646 2012-02-09 09:22:49.0 login to vote score 0
    burntman: yes, because writing long screeds detailing your personal thoughts and experiences makes them valid no matter how insane they are.

    whatever, man. Characteristic of blindness is the inability to see.
    If you logged in, you could post here.